Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

[souldead341]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

Charging money for a mod for TES4? Really? How greedy can you get?

Well, to be fair, if you made a mod that people were willing to pay for, you'd probably go for it.

The bigger issue is using other people's work to make money, instead of making all the assets for it yourself. And that's what happened with both the oblivion and rpg maker (I assume on that one) versions of cursed armor. There's an older RPG maker game called Adventures of Garnet that has a lot of the sprites that were used in Cursed armor. It's been dead for a long while, but here's the github if you're interested:

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[f4s1k1n]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

I think AOG is continued by new developer, you can find the info at hongfire...

You must be registered to see the links

 

[The Lurkers Shadow]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

Well, to be fair, if you made a mod that people were willing to pay for, you'd probably go for it.

The bigger issue is using other people's work to make money, instead of making all the assets for it yourself. And that's what happened with both the oblivion and rpg maker (I assume on that one) versions of cursed armor. There's an older RPG maker game called Adventures of Garnet that has a lot of the sprites that were used in Cursed armor. It's been dead for a long while, but here's the github if you're interested:

You must be registered to see the links

Actually the sprites are more from Ring of lust than Garnet, though Garnet uses the same character as Ring of lust, Ki from the Tower of Druaga game as the main character just normally renamed.

 

[Nimrod]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

What? Pirate the thing all you want. Just don't post it here, is that really a hard concept to understand?

I thought the playful punctuation and onomatopeic were enough to reveal the joke for what it was. Maybe if i used emoticons too...

Jokes aside, all this talk about intellectual properties and stealing assets is kinda lost on me, considering the shitload of games using characters from video games, anime, cartoons, etc...

Frankly i don't give a fuck if he's using assets from a 15+ years old rpgm chinese game that was released for free, are we going to crucify the entire chinese bootleg comunity, if anything it fits chinese culture to a T.

The game he's making is completely different than ring of lust, and the other rip off that was adventure of garnet, to fall well under transformative in my book.

Also about the modding comunity, 100% of their production value is taking someone else's work and modifying it to make their stuff.

 

[The Lurkers Shadow]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

I thought the playful punctuation and onomatopeic were enough to reveal the joke for what it was. Maybe if i used emoticons too...

Jokes aside, all this talk about intellectual properties and stealing assets is kinda lost on me, considering the shitload of games using characters from video games, anime, cartoons, etc...

Frankly i don't give a fuck if he's using assets from a 15+ years old rpgm chinese game that was released for free, are we going to crucify the entire chinese bootleg comunity, if anything it fits chinese culture to a T.

The game he's making is completely different than ring of lust, and the other rip off that was adventure of garnet, to fall well under transformative in my book.


Also about the modding comunity, 100% of their production value is taking someone else's work and modifying it to make their stuff.

I don't think it's because of the sprites from ring of lust being used that got the thread tossed but other things he has done and perhaps stolen. last post in the old thread was pointing out an oblivion mod and something about not trusting wolfzq because of it. I failed to notice exactly what it was but might have something to do with it or maybe something in Cursed armor was taken without permission with the clothing or cgs. The sprites themselves it's unlikely it was that since the original creator was ok with stuff being used if I recall correctly.

As for content theft, it tends to be rage inducing for many when something you made free or otherwise is taken by another and turned into a money making source without your permission. No one likes others getting rich off their hard work and effort while the thief sits on their ass laughing about it. For games using characters, it more comes down to parody or homages rather than straight up content theft and most cases can't or won't charge money for said item based on either respect or fear of the owner of said character.

Some people might not mind others using something they made for a purpose that was not envisioned for them to begin with, but when money becomes involved that's when a line is drawn. It's just good etiquette to ask a content creator if someone can use their ideas for free or for money just taking and redoing something is just plain dickish and will piss off a lot of people. Just because it's been a norm to steal shit and reskin it in the culture doesn't mean its a good thing that should be overlooked. It takes minimal effort to ask someone "Hey, may I use this?"

TLDR: Assorted rambling bullshit.

PS: Seems wolfzq has taken notice about the thread removal and ban. If anyone would like to see the post he made about it I can post it here if anyone is curious about it. It's hard for me to know for certain if his current actions are in line with the more suspect actions of his past without more information, all we can do right now is speculate.

 

[mayaktheunholy]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

Also about the modding comunity, 100% of their production value is taking someone else's work and modifying it to make their stuff.

In addition to what The Lurkers Shadow said:
Yes, FREELY taking others' work and adding/mixing/improving. The whole reason the system works and we have as many mods as we do is because it is all free and open. Not hidden behind a paywall. Not charging money for other people's hard work. Also, the vast majority of it is only free to use in derivative works as long as the original authors are credited.

But that is in regards to modding only, I have no knowledge of, or comments on, the current game's situation. (Nor do I particularly give a shit about it, was just adding what info I had about the author's past work)


Edit: And to whoever negrepped me for my last post, I don't even know Ark of Truth, never had any dealings with him whatsoever. But I know who you are talking about.

 

[Deleted member 166393]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

In addition to what The Lurkers Shadow said:
Yes, FREELY taking others' work and adding/mixing/improving. The whole reason the system works and we have as many mods as we do is because it is all free and open. Not hidden behind a paywall. Not charging money for other people's hard work. Also, the vast majority of it is only free to use in derivative works as long as the original authors are credited.

But that is in regards to modding only, I have no knowledge of, or comments on, the current game's situation. (Nor do I particularly give a shit about it, was just adding what info I had about the author's past work)

The way you talk about the mods hidden behind a paywall makes me think you were and still are mad that people were willing to pay for them.

 

[mayaktheunholy]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

The way you talk about the mods hidden behind a paywall makes me think you were and still are mad that people were willing to pay for them.

It's not that I'm mad that people were willing to pay, modders deserve some form of thanks for giving us all this entertainment. I just think it would be a detriment to the entire modding scene if mods went to a paywall format. "free but accepting donations" while maybe not ideal, at least allows for continuing the current "open" format where modders are free to build on each others work to make larger, more complex mods.

(And I'm far from the only one. Steam took down their paid modding scheme for a reason.)

 

[nightshad]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

I don't think it's because of the sprites from ring of lust being used that got the thread tossed but other things he has done and perhaps stolen. last post in the old thread was pointing out an oblivion mod and something about not trusting wolfzq because of it. I failed to notice exactly what it was but might have something to do with it or maybe something in Cursed armor was taken without permission with the clothing or cgs. The sprites themselves it's unlikely it was that since the original creator was ok with stuff being used if I recall correctly.

As for content theft, it tends to be rage inducing for many when something you made free or otherwise is taken by another and turned into a money making source without your permission. No one likes others getting rich off their hard work and effort while the thief sits on their ass laughing about it. For games using characters, it more comes down to parody or homages rather than straight up content theft and most cases can't or won't charge money for said item based on either respect or fear of the owner of said character.

Some people might not mind others using something they made for a purpose that was not envisioned for them to begin with, but when money becomes involved that's when a line is drawn. It's just good etiquette to ask a content creator if someone can use their ideas for free or for money just taking and redoing something is just plain dickish and will piss off a lot of people. Just because it's been a norm to steal shit and reskin it in the culture doesn't mean its a good thing that should be overlooked. It takes minimal effort to ask someone "Hey, may I use this?"

TLDR: Assorted rambling bullshit.

PS: Seems wolfzq has taken notice about the thread removal and ban. If anyone would like to see the post he made about it I can post it here if anyone is curious about it. It's hard for me to know for certain if his current actions are in line with the more suspect actions of his past without more information, all we can do right now is speculate.

sure. . .

 

[Evident Disaster]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

Jesus I just freaking joined on Patreon...

In any case, I'm not sure whether or not I can access the game since I don't know how the guy works, does anyone know? Or should I just go and ask on Patreon. He doesn't seem to give many direct answers.

 

[The Lurkers Shadow]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

Jesus I just freaking joined on Patreon...

In any case, I'm not sure whether or not I can access the game since I don't know how the guy works, does anyone know? Or should I just go and ask on Patreon. He doesn't seem to give many direct answers.

From what I remember the game will be sent out on the 5th once your pledge has been accepted so should arrive in a few days if your pledge went through this month.


@nightshad
Do you mean sure put up the post? Or was that a yeah.. sure kind of reply I'm not certain.

 

[nightshad]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

From what I remember the game will be sent out on the 5th once your pledge has been accepted so should arrive in a few days if your pledge went through this month.


@nightshad
Do you mean sure put up the post? Or was that a yeah.. sure kind of reply I'm not certain.

it was a sure put up the post lets see what the little thief has to say for himeself

 

[The Lurkers Shadow]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

Google Translated:

I am not good in English, so I am afraid that there will be ambiguous in English, I first said in Chinese
This time because of my concern ulmf less, until the problem occurs, my friend's posting number has been locked, and then I use my number to deal with the negotiations, they said my loverlab on the post of cursed armor infringement , And there are acts that rely on infringement for profit, so if I can not prove that I am not the wolfzq (not those things that are not infringing for profit), it closes my account and never allows cursed armor to enter umlf.

After I responded,

1, my RPG does not have any infringement, all things are their own research and development or authorized.

2, I released the patreon propaganda in loverlab 1 year ago, some of which pictures themselves want to guide the players to look at the crowd, which the contents of the picture are not released, because the ancient 4 eventually I stopped the development, so There is no profit.

3, even if my ancient 4 my behavior on the loverlab caused harm, but the RPG did not cause any harm to umlf, why loverlab not sealed my last 4 posts, umlf have to seal my RPG posts, and even made a lock My account's malicious behavior? !

When I finished this information, umlf did not give me any reply, then my account was locked, from the previous text, can only understand that I was wolfzq so it is necessary to seal ... ... So, this behavior really okay? Such a forum worthy of the players sought after? I started to doubt ...

UMLF is a professional forum, is a player in the hearts of the pivotal forum, but such a professional forum because of a very small number of players malicious attacks, and choose to be a pout, independent copyright of the game to ban, or even do not give Opportunity rectification, because some players on the producer of the previous wrong behavior dissatisfaction, and lead to lifelong expulsion? How can the forum serve 9 of 10 players, or is it a player who is considered too radical in most people?

Original post for those who might translate better than google:

我英文不好，所以怕這里用英文會有歧義，我先用中文說
這次的事件由于我關注ulmf比較少，等到問題出現時，我朋友的發帖號已經被鎖了，之后我用我的號去跟管理交涉，他們說我的在loverlab關于cursed armor的帖子有侵權行為，并且有依靠侵權行為牟利的行為，所以，如果我無法舉證我不是那個wolfzq（而不是那些東西沒有侵權牟利），就封我賬號并且永遠不允許cursed armor 進入umlf。

之后我回應，

1、我的RPG中沒有任何侵權行為，所有東西都是自己研發或者有授權的。

2、我在loverlab放出的patreon宣傳帖是1年前的，其中有一些圖片本身是希望引導玩家來看看眾籌網站，其中圖片的內容都沒有放出，因為上古4最終我停止了開發，所以也不存在牟利。

3、就算我上古4我的行為對loverlab造成了危害，但RPG并沒有對umlf造成任何危害，為什么loverlab不封我上古4的帖，umlf卻要封我RPG的帖，甚至還做出了鎖我賬號的惡意行為？！

當我發完這些信息后，umlf沒有給我任何回信，之后我的賬號就被鎖了，從前文中，只能理解我是wolfzq所以就要封……那么，這種行為真的好嗎？這樣的論壇值得玩家追捧嗎？我開始懷疑了……

UMLF是一個專業論壇，是一個在玩家心中舉足輕重的論壇，但是，這么一個專業論壇卻因為極少數玩家的惡意攻擊，而選擇將一個正在撅起的，有獨立版權的游戲進行封殺，甚至不給機會整改，就因為某些玩家對這個制作人以前的錯誤行為不滿，而招致終生驅逐？試問論壇是服務10個玩家中的9個，還是滿足那1個在多數人都認為過激的玩家？

 

[Balmunk Fezarion]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

我英文不好，所以怕這里用英文會有歧義，我先用中文說
這次的事件由于我關注ulmf比較少，等到問題出現時，我朋友的發帖號已經被鎖了，之后我用我的號去跟管理交涉，他們說我的在loverlab關于cursed armor的帖子有侵權行為，并且有依靠侵權行為牟利的行為，所以，如果我無法舉證我不是那個wolfzq（而不是那些東西沒有侵權牟利），就封我賬號并且永遠不允許cursed armor 進入umlf。

之后我回應，

1、我的RPG中沒有任何侵權行為，所有東西都是自己研發或者有授權的。

2、我在loverlab放出的patreon宣傳帖是1年前的，其中有一些圖片本身是希望引導玩家來看看眾籌網站，其中圖片的內容都沒有放出，因為上古4最終我停止了開發，所以也不存在牟利。

3、就算我上古4我的行為對loverlab造成了危害，但RPG并沒有對umlf造成任何危害，為什么loverlab不封我上古4的帖，umlf卻要封我RPG的帖，甚至還做出了鎖我賬號的惡意行為？！

當我發完這些信息后，umlf沒有給我任何回信，之后我的賬號就被鎖了，從前文中，只能理解我是wolfzq所以就要封……那么，這種行為真的好嗎？這樣的論壇值得玩家追捧嗎？我開始懷疑了……

UMLF是一個專業論壇，是一個在玩家心中舉足輕重的論壇，但是，這么一個專業論壇卻因為極少數玩家的惡意攻擊，而選擇將一個正在撅起的，有獨立版權的游戲進行封殺，甚至不給機會整改，就因為某些玩家對這個制作人以前的錯誤行為不滿，而招致終生驅逐？試問論壇是服務10個玩家中的9個，還是滿足那1個在多數人都認為過激的玩家？

lol google translate kind of defeated the purpose of the Chinese statement, he doesn't want to make a confusing/inaccurate English one,
though Google is surprisingly accurate this time.

Basically, his friend started the Cursed Armor thread. After the friend account gets banned, he contacted the admins, and the admins told him that his contents on Loverslab are copyright infringement and he profited off those. Therefore if he can't prove he is not the same wolfzq on Loverslab, he will be permabanned from ULMF.

His replies to the admins:
1. All contents in his RPG are either original or authorized.

2. The images on his Loverslab Oblivion thread are presented to advertise his Patreon. He did not distribute the contents in the image and has halted the project. Therefore he did not make profit off it.
(I'm guessing it is about the Oblivion mods, he might have used someone else's content for his image)

3. His behavior on his Oblivion mods might have been malicious to Loverslab but his RPG doesn't go against anything in ULMF. Why would ULMF ban him when Loverslab hasn't even take any actions?

He got banned before receiving a reply. From his understanding he thinks that ULMF banned him for simply being wolfzq.

Then he thinks that as a professional forum, ULMF should not kill an indie game just because someone held a grudge against the developer's past mistakes and maliciously reported him. And the forum should serve the majority who enjoyed the game but not the one who complained.

Something like that

 

[mayaktheunholy]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

I'd say if mods/admin banned both him and his friend, and his game, then they must have some solid evidence of his plagiarism or copyright infringement, whatever you want to call it. But none of them have weighed in on the matter yet, and the above is just his side of the story.

 

[Shadowen]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

I'd say if mods/admin banned both him and his friend, and his game, then they must have some solid evidence of his plagiarism or copyright infringement, whatever you want to call it. But none of them have weighed in on the matter yet, and the above is just his side of the story.

Actually an Admin of this site has already responded about this issue. Read the following quote from the admin in question:

I removed the thread myself personally because a question came up of the content belonging intellectually to Wolfzq himself, and the legality of some other projects of his as well as the patreon, Cursed Armor, and other issues. There was enough information brought to me in the form of links, screenshots, etc, to warrant the Immediate removal of the thread. I understand you all have questions and that's the answer to the majority of them.

Others might include "Will Cursed Armor be allowed to be reposted or linked Here on ULMF?" The answer is No, the same goes for any links to his patreon or the like.

Nor will I be disclosing the information that led to this, links, names, etc.

And yes, they are an admin. Check the Forum Leaders page and you will see them listed as both a Moderator and Admin of this forum.

 

[Nimrod]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

So, from what he says, he was not given a chance to make a case for himself, he was banned for something that is not related to this forum, and the unilateral decision was based on proof he did not have a chance to refute or contestualize by sharing his side of the story.

On top of that he's gonna be permanently branded a "thief" because he "stole" something that was "free", and will never have a chance to redeem himself or prove he can overcome his past mistakes.

Maybe i'm weird, but i think even a murderer should be given a fair trial before execution.

 

[ments]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

So, from what he says, he was not given a chance to make a case for himself, he was banned for something that is not related to this forum, and the unilateral decision was based on proof he did not have a chance to refute or contestualize by sharing his side of the story.

On top of that he's gonna be permanently branded a "thief" because he "stole" something that was "free", and will never have a chance to redeem himself or prove he can overcome his past mistakes.

Maybe i'm weird, but i think even a murderer should be given a fair trial before execution.

Did you miss this? There was enough information brought to me in the form of links, screenshots, etc, to warrant the Immediate removal of the thread.
and one can always contact admin via e-mail, and explain situation

 

[FruitSmoothie]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

I'd say if mods/admin banned both him and his friend, and his game, then they must have some solid evidence of his plagiarism or copyright infringement, whatever you want to call it. But none of them have weighed in on the matter yet, and the above is just his side of the story.

They didn't want to show any evidence, don't you find that strange? I have nothing against the mods here from the past, but I also have no reason to blindly trust their decision. They should be able to understand why people would be skeptical if not given any proof. It shouldn't be difficult to say: "We have proof that this and that are used without consent from the original author", correct? Not like it puts anybody at risk.

Getting the vibe that maybe they just assumed the dev didn't have authorization to use something for his current work based on previous examples (He says it's all authorized). And maybe he doesn't, but I believe the burden of proof would be on ulmf mods in this case. They're the ones who took his thread down with little to no communication/explanation. Plenty of people use other people's assets with permission without showing evidence of the granted permissions (Until somebody asks about it). I find it strange to feel the need to bring up his past issues at all if they have proof of issues with his wolf project.

I'm all for branding people who steal from others thieves, but what I find odd is if Curse Armor had nothing going on, why attach problems with a previous issue to his thread here? Agreed that his past mistakes shouldn't effect his thread here. Seems more like they jumped the gun atm, though feel free to prove me wrong with evidence. I can only go off the information I currently have after all. You wanna make a case, go for it. Atm the dev's message makes more sense.

Though I'm also having issues with the wolf dev saying "If Loverslabs didn't ban me for acting shitty, why would ulmf?", if that's the proper translation, that worries me. Even though he says that his wolf rpg had no issues like Loverslab, kinda an immature mentality after they admit to some wrongdoings on the oblivion project. It's not like it's the same scenario, even he says the Loverslabs project had some issues. If he thinks so little of his past mistakes, maybe they aren't just past mistakes.

I should also mention that I didn't even post in/pay attention to the thread myself, so I'm about as unbiased as you can be in this case. Heard some people talking about how the dev usually acts childish, but I've never personally seen it.

 

[stone147]

Re: Cursed Armor 1.40 wolfzq thread missing?

So, from what he says, he was not given a chance to make a case for himself, he was banned for something that is not related to this forum, and the unilateral decision was based on proof he did not have a chance to refute or contestualize by sharing his side of the story.

On top of that he's gonna be permanently branded a "thief" because he "stole" something that was "free", and will never have a chance to redeem himself or prove he can overcome his past mistakes.

Maybe i'm weird, but i think even a murderer should be given a fair trial before execution.

Pretty much this!

My point of view:
I think the game is very well done. Wolfzq did nothing wrong with Cursed armor. Sure the translation is kinda meh, he didn't give much information(update-wise) and his behavior seems childish(maybe coz' the language barrier) but also its a good game with much content and its really worth a try. also he wants 1$ for the uncensored game(maybe its unfinished right now, but even then its still worth much more than 1$)
I dont know about his modding-past but also, im not interested since the PAST is over. perhaps he learned something from it.


Maybe just give his thread/game a second chance?
(maybe not, since i dont know waht exactly had happened in the thread)

Best regards