Announcement Apparently this is a factor: Threats

[Ryka]

I have been pondering a few things. Bald eagles, gurus, and ninjas.

Somewhat related to all these is the fact that, while we are a big community and the chance is wide, this forum has users that wouldn't mind giving out threats of violence to our game developers.

I would agree that it MIGHT feel a tad unfair if one were to pend money on a game that would take time to finish. But this extends over to our friends developing free games as well. And on that note, threats are still not a thing to use to get what you want. We have a whole country that hates that sort of concept.

Threatening a developer with violence is the same as threatening to play with matches when Mom or Dad won't give you a Wii U. Do not. We are past that.

I have a suggestion for the developers that have been getting threats of violence in their inbox. While mostly unmonitored, the forum takes great notice of harassment. And nothing is more proof than a copied and pasted PM. If you feel threatened by another user, silently PM DarkFire or someone. Threats should be a bannable offense if not something to file a civil suit over.

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

 

[kokotheworm]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

There is this little concept you might have heard of , the Law . Pretty sure it's meant to both solve conflict about money ,especially investing money , and threat , who in most legal system are not tolerated .
So while your post is a nice thing to read I assume we are all adult here and now that there is consequence for our action even on the web .

 

[Ryka]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

Unfortunately there are those here that do not understand such things. And therefore this regrettably HAS to be brought to peoples' attention.

If there is a rule brought up about something odd, it most likely had been a problem. Same concept as this. People should know better, but it still happens.

 

[spike4379]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

Only douchebags actually threaten and i wouldnt worry about them being physical as most of them are weak little bastards ^-^
also i think this may be in the wrong section

 

[erobotan]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

why the hell someone want to kill a hentai gamedev? I'm curious with the reason ... on a more positive note, at least it means that people recognize his/her work ^^

 

[Ryka]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

My best guess is that they are unstable. That or they take their feeding their porn gullet.... way more seriously than a normal person.

 

[Larcx]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I can see the flow this thread will going to...

Just take Your Money back / issue a refund

 

[azurezero]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I haven't recieved any threats... does that mean i'm more or less liked than i expected?

 

[erobotan]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I haven't recieved any threats... does that mean i'm more or less liked than i expected?

i'm in the same boat as you .. so lonely ...

 

[fagballs]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I don't see how this is an actual issue. Almost nobody uses their name on this forum since, you know, this is a forum about cartoon porn? I'm pretty sure nobody wants this question on their job interview: "so we googled your name and I was wondering: what do you find most appealing about a weirdly drawn woman getting all her holes pounded by unrealistic tentacles?"

Websites like Patreon shouldn't hand out personal information about the creators either. If they do, it's time to look for a new service.

Honestly, the only viable way of getting your personal information is using vbulletin exploits (this website is running an ancient version) to get your IP address and then somehow hope that you don't have a dynamic IP address.

As for the threats themselves: you're on the internet. People behave like dicks. You'll get used to it eventually.

 

[azurezero]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

"what do you find most appealing about a weirdly drawn woman getting all her holes pounded by unrealistic tentacles?"

It's simply the idea of being completely overcome by pleasure...

 

[censuur]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

So this might get a bit heavy-handed here, but I feel I need to explain some basic things about the internet, and threats in particular, because this topic is absolutely nonsensical.

First off, someone telling you they will hurt you is not a threat, at least not a credible one, the intent of actual violence is rarely involved.

Why do people threaten others? It's for two main reasons; Intimidation (and this is the main one) to coerce someone into action without actual violence (in most cases, if you intend to harm someone, you'd just do it, not warn the person beforehand) The other main reason is frustration, and this one is what you will regularly encounter on the internet in many forms, some people will just swear at you, others will threaten you will violence, anything to make the recipient uncomfortable.

Because that's all they can do. This is always going to be a thing on the internet, it has been for the dozen years that I've regularly used it, and if I lost a week of my life for every person that threatened physical harm upon me I wouldn't be here right now. People will threaten you because that's all they can do, a customer who has been scammed by a retailer can't really do much when the transaction is over the internet, this situation is getting better, but we still see plenty of cases of large, high profile scams on the internet which simply do not get answered legally.

So what can you, as a customer do? All you can do is shout, scream and threaten. So they do. Powerlessness coupled with frustration leads to people doing whatever they actually CAN do, which is to threaten you with violence, if the popular figures on the internet can be believed they receive hundreds of threats of violence every week and in years, nothing has come of it, because threats are natural on the internet. They are also entirely meaningless, as I said at the very beginning, a person who actually intends to go and harm you, won't nicely warn you before hand, they will look up your address, get on a plane and fuck you up, and let's also be sure to note a person who would do this is already psychotic, the involvement of threats and the internet are an entirely negligible factor.

Everyone gets threatened on the internet. This is rarely a problem for the recipient unless they feel they've done something to warrant the threat, because this makes it "believable" that someone would do something, call it victim blaming but any credibility to an online threat is generally in the hands of the recipient, as they've done something to get someone so angry they would reciprocate with actual violence, which they would know will have harsh consequences and likely prison time.

Threats on the internet are rarely credible unless "justified" so unless you've done something that you shouldn't, or are doing something that you shouldn't, don't bother acknowledging their existence, because taking away the only way for frustrated, powerless people to vent their frustrations, is much more likely to provoke REAL violence, we do not WANT to solve internet threats because this IS the peaceful alternative to other mean of expressing frustration.

Suck it up and deal with it, princess.

 

[PM21]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

Are there actual threats being made or is this all conjecture?

If there are real threats to developers I would assume those developers would A) Ignore it, because negative criticism and people being assholes comes with the territory B) report it to moderators and/or admins if it is deemed a serious issue of harassment. Because a person who takes up the mantle of creating and providing content to the masses would on the whole be mature enough to deal with criticism and internet harassment appropriately.

Of course, the best way to dignify a harasser and internet asshole is to give him/her attention.

I don't doubt there have been threats made in the history of this forum or elsewhere to a developer because it's the internet. No, it doesn't excuse the behavior but in lieu of removing those people from the internet entirely is to deny them the attention they so crave and silently have them reported and banned if it's a real problem.

What's next? People going to the U.N. and complaining that their feelings are being hurt over the internet? Oh, wait.

 

[dood]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

In my opinion receiving threats should not result in you complaining about it in an open forum. Just report it to the police (and no I'm pretty sure that unless the porno industry is illegal in your country, they won't mess with you). If you report it here, where you know, the people who threatened you can read it; then all you are doing is letting them know that their threats worked and they can get what they want.

We can see this in video game's media, none of the threats they talk about are credible at all and yet they continue to lie about it and pretend that men don't matter on the internet (yeah sorry I gotta get a little political here). Its very ironic that they push the agenda that women are being harassed by men while being predominantly run by white males and saying any female who objects doesn't count. I mean they don't even cover the crap that's been done to Christina Sommers (and I'm surprised I'm talking this here) and that's probably because they were the ones calling her a faux feminist just for having an opinion. The fact of the matter is, I've gotten death threats (not on this forum and not on this account and therefore its not hypocritical because the guy who threatened me will almost certainly not trace this message back to me, nor would they even be able to read this message). Death threats simply don't matter, they're equivalent of opening up a youtube comment section and reading "X will happen to you if you don't post this crap 5 times".

If it seems credible call the police. In this case as OP has noted, go call darkfire about it. This isn't Venezuela (ouch more political satire) where the cops are in on the harassment. Or is it.... *Scare chord*
But seriously, don't take death threats seriously guys unless its very clear they have the means to carry them out. If that's the case call the cops and that sucker will be in jail in no time.

Edit: And just to make it especially clear, cybercrime divisions tell you NEVER to complain about your harassment in an open forum where the harasser can identify you and find out whether or not his/her tactics are working. It also doesn't help that this "hysteria" over "harassment" is really just being used as a cheap pathetic way to censor the internet and stop people from saying any political opinion... because let's face it saying "I support X country" can be seen as a "threat" because X country is hostile to your country.

 

[habisain]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I'm all for a people receiving punishment for threats made, in any forum. Anyone who is thinks just because a threat is made online it should not be taken seriously is kidding themselves. Doxxing is a thing which happens, and so threats made online must be taken credibly - especially true that in any paid project, any doxxer would have an easy first port of call to start their enquires at. Remember, there are real life events cancelled and people having to make changes to their life due to threats made online (an example that people here will most likely know about would probably be Zoe Quinn/Anita Sarkeesian who have been persecuted by the GamerGate movement). This doesn't go into the various psychological parts of having threats made against you - it's really not a good feeling.

Still, good to know it's not just me who's received threats; I had some made against me on Hongfire ages back, and the best method of dealing with it is to just go to the mods. (And I don't even make H-games, just translation tools...). Or rather it's not good to know, but, well, something. I don't really know the sentiment I'm trying to express here...

 

[OnyxShadow]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

1. Game discussion forum...
2. Threats are rare.
3. Anyone who does that sort of crap isn't gonna listen to your pleas.

 

[censuur]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I'm all for a people receiving punishment for threats made, in any forum. Anyone who is thinks just because a threat is made online it should not be taken seriously is kidding themselves.

I sincerely hope this is a bad joke. Either way it's clear you've spent little time thinking about this and are just spouting empty platitudes.

(an example that people here will most likely know about would probably be Zoe Quinn/Anita Sarkeesian who have been persecuted by the GamerGate movement).

First off, this is libel and is a more persecutable offense than making threats online you god damned hypocrite, second off theirs is a case against your argument, as for all the threats they've only gotten better off rather than worse, they made a god damn living off of being threatened on the internet, even though both of them have been proven on several occasions to deceive, lie and manipulate.

And doxxing? Please man if you knew anything about the people you refer to you'd know Zoe herself has done quite a bit of doxxing, if anything "you reap what you sow" is applicable here.


First thing you do when you want to discuss action is to account for the elements, in this case the people, involved. Why do the victims get threatened and why do the perpetrators threaten, you do not just go spout "it's bad and needs to stop" that is as ridiculous as it is juvenile. Taking away peoples one way of venting frustration with deceit and lies on the internet will only prompt harsher actions, things do not magically go away, they must be solved, that goes for the motivation of any "criminal" as well.

 

[Ryka]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I really do not understand why suggesting bringing violent people to Forum Justice merits negreps, pet names, and negativity.

Is this a silently taken issue and those who are upset the ones actually making such terroristic threats?

This is one thing the Lili will not apologize for.

Oh, and for accounts to threats that had shut down development or possibly caused issues or angry developers have been, off the top of my head, HentaiWriter, when I learned after my suspicions that he had recieved personal threats while being more open here, making him have to take more non-open means of news reveals. The creator of Kunoichi Ninpocho, who had to outright cut development when he recieved threats if he did not include a specific character. (I could be wrong about the developer though. All I know is this did happen.) And at some point, Zeta R02, the creator of Project X. But she is cool and didn't let it affect her progress in any way.

 

[habisain]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

First off, this is libel and is a more persecutable offense than making threats online you god damned hypocrite, second off theirs is a case against your argument, as for all the threats they've only gotten better off rather than worse, they made a god damn living off of being threatened on the internet, even though both of them have been proven on several occasions to deceive, lie and manipulate.

While I'm not going to respond to most of your comment because it's obvious I'm not going to change your opinion, on the subject of me doing 'libel' I draw your attention to the following definition of persecution: "The act or practice of persecuting on the basis of race, religion, gender, sexual orientation, or beliefs that differ from those of the persecutor." (Source:

You must be registered to see the links

)

Given the fact that the Gamergate movement has made threats to Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian (source:

You must be registered to see the links

because I'm being lazy, other sources exist, including the actual death/rape threats made) over a sustained period of time, primarily on the basis that the members of the Gamergate movement believe that the critism that Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian make of the representation of women in videogames is unfair, I believe it is a factual statement to say "The Gamergate movement has persecuted Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian".

I have presented my case for my side of the argument, and am trying to de-escalate this; I would now appreciate you to do the same if you want to continue this discussion, preferably in PM as it is not on topic. Note that if unjustifiable threats of legal action continue, I'm following my own advice and referring this to mods.

 

[censuur]

Re: Apparently this is a factor: Threats

I really do not understand why suggesting bringing violent people to Forum Justice merits negreps, pet names, and negativity.

Is this a silently taken issue and those who are upset the ones actually making such terroristic threats?

This is one thing the Lili will not apologize for.

I'll try to explain why people are upset with you, and in the future I hope you can be bothered to spend some time trying to understand other people, rather than just trying to demonize them.

See, you've started a topic with an accusation; people are being threatened, ergo people are making threats, people here are doing so, and this is irredeemably bad. You've started a conversation by taking a side, and rather than trying to see both sides you've already demonized one of them, the people making threats, as being exclusively wrong. In doing so, you're indirectly defending the practices those people respond to with threats, people do not make threats lightly (children might, for shits and giggles, but I can assume we're all adults here) and do so for a reason.

Now, we could argue whether or not that reason is valid, but that's not what we're discussing here, we're discussing why people are angry with you. They're angry with you because you're not even giving them the benefit of doubt, you're dismissing their very real frustrations and very real problems, while handwaving the issues that caused them. If someone has been scammed (lets just take a kickstarter for example) and ripped off by someone, with no way to retaliate or get justice in a situation that is injust, what do you think such a person would do? Many people will just cut their losses and berate themselves for being scammed, other people can not do that so easily. When you're emotionally invested in a product, when you spent money on something when you're not well-off to start with, when you then get robbed and (often) insulted by the person who did so, it is only natural to be angry, livid even.

Now, if your local specialty store does this, you'd go over to them, threaten to sue or threaten to beat the everliving fuck out of them unless they give you what's yours, you take action to ensure justice. On the internet, that luxury does not exist, justice is denied and the best you can do is try and intimidate the wrongdoer into correcting his behavior, so threats.

Now, you come here, and tell people that threats are not okay, regardless of their justification, you give no argument, no examples, you just come here and stir shit, and obviously this is going to upset people, you fucked up.

Best you can do, is learn what your mistakes are, apologize for them, and work to correct them, spouting platitudes is a damn insult to anyone with half a wit, and you did just that.