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maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Hokey... wow... that's a lot more than I thought I had in me... here's the timeline, along with a quick summation at the end about the current state of affairs. Also, it's 1257 characters too long for one post, so double posting ahoy.

Easterlands - The Dragon Empire

The Age of Dragons- ca.1 000 000 ya
In ancient times, it is said, when the land was wild and tameable, the dragons were the undisputed rulers. Some ruled by might and fear, others with compassion and reason. Then, as now, the forces of evil sought to conquer the middle ground, the mortal realm, in their cosmic battle against the forces of good. The dragons were able to defend their realms against the demons, but dragons breed very slowly, and the demon armies are inexhaustible. Slowly but steadily, the dragons' numbers dwindled. Some dragons saw the rising strength of their mortal minions and decided to impart some of their strength, so that, should the dragons ultimately fall, the mortals would be able to defend themselves against any invaders, demonic or angelic. The age of the Dragon Kings began.

The Age of the Dragon Kings- ca.200 000 ya
Dragons still ruled in this age, but their powers were falling steadily as the mortals, led by their leaders, given the power of the dragons, rose. Expanding their territories and even coming to blows with their former masters, the mortals soon dominated the land just as the dragons had done prior to them. The mortal ingenuity and their numbers, combined with the dragon's powers, allowed them to soundly defeat the demons time and again, until ultimately, after a crushing defeat, the demons retreated. With powerful magic, the mortals shut the gates to the dark realms, ensuring that never again, will demons threaten the world.

With peace now ruling the lands, the dragon kings turned their armies on each other, vying for power. With the dragons' strength diminished to the point that they no longer had any power over their former subjects, there was nothing to stop the mortals from waging wars against each other.

One dragon king, a powerful necromancer named Al'Zharid, who found his kingdom crumbling around him and his armies dropping like flies against his foes, decided to ensure that, if he fell, none of his foes would gain anything from his loss. Wielding dread magic, he ravaged his lands, turning verdant grasslands to barren desert and causing trees to turn to unliving stone. To this day, his former kingdom is still a barren wasteland, populated only by undead and those few who are hardy enough to survive in the harshest of climates.

Seeing the great lengths that some of them would go to to destroy their enemies, or prevent them from gaining any power, the other dragon kings recalled their armies. They set up boundaries, marking their territories out, and while such determination was not without strife, it was a far more peaceful process than the wars previously, and ultimately, more successful. For ages, peace was the norm, with wars fought only rarely, relative to the otherwise placid times.

The Age of Peace- ca.120 000 ya
The peace lasted for tens of thousands of years. The lines of the dragon kings continued ruling, but as the ages wore on, their draconic blood thinned. Some turned to inbreeding, in attempts to retain their power, which brought about new problems. Over time, the lines of the dragon kings diminished and fell. Their rulership replaced by warlords, merchant kings, politicians, and priests.

The Age of Mortals- ca.15 000 ya
The current age. Only one line of dragon kings survived this far, that of the Jade Emperors of the aptly named Jade Empire, far to the east of Zharid's Wastes. Making allies with the other denizens of that land, the Jade Empire was the single greatest power left in the land. It was, however, very cautious and xenophobic. Trade with the other lands slowed and eventually fell off. Travel through Zharid's Wastes was exceptionally hazardous, and the sea routes weren't much easier. Over time, the empire was forgotten in the west, and likewise, the west forgotten in the empire.

In the west, the disparate races, each formerly ruled by a dragon king, continued to live apart, bickering and occasionally fighting, even amongst each other. Eventually, a school of thought arose, first in the humans, but quickly spreading to the others. Called the Golden Path, it suggested that true power lay in money, not in strength of arms or magical might, for those could be bought. This philosophy of greed soon permeated the western lands, ultimately uniting them into a loose coalition of merchant states. While each had only their own interests in mind, they knew that by trading with others, they would enrich themselves. The goal, as they saw it, was to always come out ahead of whoever they were dealing with. The result was a climate of cautious backstabbing and swindling, but one that fostered growth.

While the western lands grew in their persuit of money, and thus, power, the Jade Empire stagnated. With their dragon emperor still able to keep the peace, there was no need for advancement. Combat became ritualized, eventually only taught to aristocrats as a pass-time of the privileged. Instead, the arts flourished. The pursuit of beauty became the great virtue of the Empire, with magnificent buildings and stunning artworks replacing fortifications and weapons. The Empire became mostly interested in the glories of the past, with ancestor worship becoming highly popular, alongside the existing naturalistic spirit worship of many of the beastfolk. Great shrines and monasteries were built to the spirits of the land and of past heroes.

The War of the Dragons- 200 ya
As peaceful as the Jade Empire was, it was not without the occasional strife. After the death of the Emperor without leaving a clear heir, his two sons began a war of succession. It didn't take long for the war to become known as the War of the Dragons, with the two warring princes known as the Ruby Dragon and the Emerald Dragon, due to the red and green armors the respective sides wore. The war was, relative to the wars of the dragon kings of the past, very tame, with strict rules of engagement and few casualties. For the peasants lucky enough to avoid being conscripted, the war seemed almost like an entertaining distraction.

Ultimately, the Emerald Dragon, Ryuoshu Midori, claimed victory when his brother died due to an untreated infection, and the land returned to it's usual peace.

Dragon Powder Arrives in the West- 199 ya
During the War of the Dragons, a chemist by the name of Tamaya, who lost his son in the fighting, left the lands overcome with grief. Traveling into Zharid's Wastes, expecting to die, he was instead found by western outriders, patrolling the wastes to keep the undead population down. While Tamaya was unwilling to reveal the secrets of his Flaming Dragons and Dragon Powder, the inquisitive gnomes quickly reverse engineered the formula for the explosive mixture. While less stable than the traditional Dragon Powder, this new Black Powder was quickly adapted into weaponry, both heavy cannons and artillery, and portable firearms. These weapons proved unreliable, compared to the traditional bows and crossbows of the time, but terrifyingly powerful, so in many cases, the trade-off was considered worth the risk.

The Second Coming of the Demons- 50 ya
With the many passing of the ages, the seals on the gates to the demon lands gradually weakened. While the war-ready western nations quickly pushed any escaping demons back and resealed the gates, the soft eastern Empire was caught completely off-guard when the gate in the northern Dragon Wing mountains spilled open. What followed was a devastating massacre as the demons moved southward, leaving ruin in their wake.

The tengus that lived in the Dragon Wing mountains were nearly wiped out by the demons, and few survive to this day. They were, however, perhaps the only reason why the demons were finally routed in the end, as it was their fleeing scouts that brought warning to the other races of the demons' return.

The kitsune and the nekugami, living in the forests at the foot of the mountains, were hit next. These two races, with long martial and magical traditions, were able to slow the demons' advance, but were similarly overwhelmed by the sheer numbers and readiness of the demon army. Their stand did buy the humans and nezumi time to build and ready their forces, but cost the two forest-dwelling races much of their people's lives.

While the demonic horde met the armed resistance of the humans and nezumi as they moved into the southern plains, the empire's lack of experience in combat meant that the defenders were pushed back and back. The capitol, the Emerald Palace, was sacked by the demons and many of the great works of art made by the empire were destroyed. Shrines were desecrated and ancestors were summoned as spirits to attack their descendants. Even the emperor himself was slain in battle. To the defenders, victory was looking to be increasingly impossible.

The Battle of Broken Pass- 31 ya
Ultimately, a small force led by an enigmatic figure known only as Murasa Kiiro, led the general of the demonic army into an ambush. The battle was fierce, with the mountain pass being devastated by demonic magic and Dragon Powder explosives (the first use of Dragon Powder as a weapon in the East). In the end, a tenth of the allied force emerged from the valley, the body of the demonic general in tow. Murasa Kiiro was missing and presumed to have perished in the fighting.

The loss of their general sent a panic through the demon army, giving the beleaguered defenders an opportunity to push back. They were ultimately successful, driving straight to the demon gate and sealing it by causing a landslide, burying it. The demon forces were scattered and broken, but remained. Most remained in the Dragon Wing mountains, where they'd occasionally strike from to harass the rebuilding mortals, while some were stuck south of Broken Pass. These southern demons wielded powerful magic to cloak their land in a perpetual mist, giving them protection from vengeful survivors, and thus their land became known as the Shadowlands.

The East Rebuilds- 27 ya
Though the empire was ultimately victorious, their lands were left ravaged. Cities were burned, shrines destroyed, rogue demons roamed the lands. But the survivors began their rebuilding. The Emerald Palace was rebuilt, though a pale imitation of the glory it once radiated. Ryuoshu Kamitori, son of the former Emperor, only six years old, was crowned, though the empire was overseen by the regent, the advisor to the former emperor, Laoren Akihito.

The West Annexes the East- 24 ya
In the middle of their rebuilding, the empire was greeted by emissaries from the west. Using gunpowder weapons and new magicks, the westerners were able to open a corridor through Zharid's Wastes and arrived in the east. Not to aid their rebuilding, but to conquer them.

Even at their peak, the Empire would have been no match for the well trained and armed western armies, so after suffering nearly total annihilation at the hands of the demons, the empire surrendered. Ryuoshu Kamitori was kept as the titular head of state, and Akihito, who had advocated for surrender, was given the position of Prime Minister.

Within a few years, the cities of the empire were rebuilt. With western money and resources, the process went much quicker than the Empire could have done on its own. The price, however, was steep. The easterners were treated as second-class citizens in their land and slavery of them became common. The traditional beliefs of the east were suppressed in favour of the secular capitalism of the westerners.

The non-human allies of the empire, the tengu, kitsune, nekugami and nezumi were treated even worse. Called 'beastfolk' by the westerners, they were often considered open game for slavery.

The Current-
Most of the empire has been rebuilt, to western design. The once beautiful artwork of the empire is now only barely visible behind the simple western designs. The easterners live in poverty, for the most part, if not outright slavery, while the western occupiers hold nearly all positions of power and continue their drive to accumulate money and power. Their lust for money have had the natural effect of causing crime, once nearly unnoticeable, to become rampant. Easterners seeing no other way to feed themselves or their family have taken to stealing, while other have embraced the western ideals of greed and either steal for the money itself, or take up the pursuit of money in business.

Many of the soldiers that came with the initial western force were let go once the transfer of power was complete, with little to no severance and with no way home. Likewise, surviving soldiers of the demon invasion that weren't caught up in the annexation have found themselves without a home. Both of these groups usually turn to banditry, with some bands being a mix of both easterners and westerners, often with little sign of the usual class structure seen in the cities. Other former soldiers typically turn to mercenary work, often coming into conflict with the former group of ex-soldiers.

The state religion, as such, that is impressed on the occupied east is that of money. There's no temples or shrines, no holy orders. The native ancestor and spirit worship are suppressed. As a result, there's very few who wield divine magic, and those that do usually need to do so in secret. That said, there have been a growing number of 'miracle workers' in recent months.

Currently, the climate in the cities is one of resigned occupation, for the most part. Much of the current generation grew up under the rule of the westerners and have started adopting their lifestyle. Outside the cities, the situation is much less certain, with bandits, rebels and demons wandering the wilds. Yet, even as things seem to be settling into an acceptable order, there is a feeling as though it's just a calm before an even greater storm.

Here's some information on the races. To note, acceptable races are the following:

Humans - Eastern or Western
Elves - Western
Dwarves - Western
Halflings - Western
Gnomes - Western
Orcs - Western
Half-Elves - Eastern or Western
Half-Orcs - Eastern or Western
Fetchlings - Eastern
Tieflings - Eastern
Changelings - Western
Tengu - Eastern
Kitsune - Eastern
Catfolk - Eastern (Also called Nekugami)
Ratfolk - Eastern (Also called Nezumi)


Humans: Typical of humans. Adaptable and ambitious. They make up the largest population in the Eastern Empire. Westerners can be found in any social level from beggar and thief to the official ambassador and leaders of merchant houses. Easterners are found only among the lower social levels. A few have begun getting into the western business trade and have begun to improve their station, but are still looked upon with disdain.

Elves: Once forest dwellers, the elves are a mostly cosmopolitan society now. Every bit as mercantile as the humans, they do still keep some link to their sylvan homelands, either with flowing artwork or potted plants or bright green and yellow clothing. Like western humans, elves can be found at just about any level of society in the Empire.
There's a small group of elves calling themselves 'The Returners' who advocate for a return to the nature dwelling ways of their species. They're mostly dismissed as wackos by the rest of the elves.

Dwarves: Not seen much in the east, the dwarves prefer to keep to their homelands. Great engineers, they build large city forts in the west, and like to stay there. Dwarves found in the east are typically soldiers, merchants or from the lowest classes looking for a better life.

Halflings: Opportunistic gypsies, halflings can be found just about everywhere, but are welcome nowhere, except their own camps. They tend to open brightly coloured stalls in streets selling just about anything, most of it stolen. One thing they specialize in, however, is the making and selling of various kinds of drugs. The downtrodden easterners are easy marks for halfling drug pushers.

Gnomes: Inventors and chemists, gnomes, like dwarves, tend to stay in their homes, but are seen a bit more widely than their bearded cousins. Gnomes are usually found among the merchant class of society, selling small automatons, alchemical concoctions and arcanotech wares. They were the ones who came up with Black Powder by examining the eastern-made Dragon Powder.

Orcs: A mostly tribal society in the west, they aren't seen widely in the east, but when they are, it's almost always as either soldiers or thugs. Of the westerners, the orcs are the only ones that have mostly kept their traditional spiritual beliefs, worshiping animal totems.

Half-Elves: Half-Elves that either arrived from the west or were born to western parents follow much of the same social models as either the elves or humans, depending on which group they grew up in more. Half-elves born in the east by an elf and an easterner are an oddity. It mostly depends on how the elven parent wants to raise their child, if at all. Those that are taken in by their elven parent are, for the most part, treated much the same as if they had been born to two western parents, though they can be seen with some confusion by westerners not so used to them.

Half-Orcs: More common than their full-blood relatives, half-orcs still fill many of the same niches; soldiers and thugs, but are also found in other roles as well. A few half-orc artisans produce beast-like totems for decoration. Half-orcs born in the east are usually the results of rape and are left to their mother to care for. They typically fall into the lower social categories of eastern humans, keeping their father's penchant for thuggery.

Fetchlings: Born to women impregnated by a demon of the shadowlands. Since it's not too hard for them to pass as human, they usually fall into the same categories as eastern humans do. They don't have a sizable enough population to have any other broad categorization. A few are found working with the tengus.

Tieflings: Born to women impregnated by one of the non-shadowlands demons. Just as varied as described. Like Fetchlings, they typically fall into the same social structure as eastern humans, but since their heritage is a bit harder to hide, they can face some extra stigma.

Changelings: Very rare westerners. They are nearly indistinguishable from regular humans and integrate them into society the same way.

Beastfolk:
Tengu: The tengu, derogatorily called 'Crows' by the westerners, already vastly weakened due to bearing the brunt of the demonic invasion, and with their homelands still occupied by the demons, were grouped into one slum in Emerald City (the renamed capitol). Though just as subjugated as the other beastfolk, the tengu were able to adapt rather well to their new situation, rather than struggle to continue their old way of life. Among tengu, it's common for any children after the first to be sold as slaves to help bring in resources for the rest of the community, and young tengu are brought up to expect this, knowing that they would be helping their people by accepting their slavery. Their talent at moving quietly and observing things, combined with the social invisibility of being a slave meant that the tengus quickly gained a reputation as information brokers. Of all the beastfolk, the tengus are treated with the most respect by the westerners for this reason.

Kitsune: The kitsune, called 'foxes', 'dogs', or even 'bitches', didn't have such an easy time adapting. Prized among westerners for their exotic looks and talent for trickery, almost all kitsune living in cities are performing slaves. All kitsune slaves are expected to entertain sexually, in addition to whatever other talents they possess. Due to their talent with magic and natural shape-shifting abilities, kitsune slaves are fitted with special collars that make use of any kind of magic or supernatural ability difficult, if not impossible.
Some kitsune survive in their native forests, free of slavery and rebuilding in secret. The secret isn't that there are free kitsune living in the forests, but rather where. Some of these free kitsune attempt to free their enslaved kin while others manage to escape their owners and flee into the woods. The westerners are content to leave the foxes to their trees, occasionally sending hunting parties into the forests, but mostly just waving them off as being too small to be any threat.
(Special Rules: Kitsune slaves start with a null-magic collar. Attempting to cast any spell or use any spell-like or supernatural abilities requires a (Charisma bonus+character level) check against a DC of 25. If the check fails, the attempt fails. Spells or spell slots are not used up and any abilities that have a number of uses per day do not count as having been used. If the check fails, the wearer automatically fails any other attempts for the next hour. If the check succeeds, the ability or spell is used as normal. Collars with higher or lower DCs are available for purchase.)
A note on Kitsune tails. Kitsune tail growth is not based on their age, but rather, how their innate magical ability matures. It's quite possible for a kitsune to die of old age with only a single tail. The last recorded nine-tailed kitsune was during the age of the dragon kings and they are essentially mythical now.

Catfolk: The nekugami, called 'cats' or, at best 'catfolk', have a similar fate as their woodland dwelling cousins. Pleasure and performing slaves mostly, they tend to end up being given a bit more freedom than the kitsune do, possibly because of their lack of innate magical abilities, or possibly because they tend to find ways to ingratiate themselves with whoever has power over them.
Though they seem to be happy to be slaves on the surface, there's rumours that there is a network of catfolk working in concert with the other beastfolk to try to overthrow the western occupiers. This thought is scoffed at by the westerners, who say that any such uprising would be swiftly, and brutally, put down.

Ratfolk: The nezumi, or ratfolk, are treated the worst of all the beastfolk. Despite their small size and lack of obvious physical threat, their association with the rats and vermin of the west mean that the westerners despise ratfolk. Kept in large slums, many ratfolk grow up in filth and disease, ultimately perpetuating the westerner's view of them as vermin. The ratfolk are adaptable, however, and seek to make the best of their poor conditions. Of all the beastfolk, they survived the demon invasion in the largest numbers, and their high birthrate meant that their population rebounded rather quickly, making ratfolk slums heavily overpopulated areas.
The westerners are fine to leave the ratfolk in their slums for the most part. Compared to the other beastfolk, the nezumi are only rarely kept as slaves. Most nezumi slaves toil at thankless, menial jobs, though a few westerners have noticed their bright minds and talent for chemistry and arcanotech and keep them working in those positions.
 
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maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Fluff Post #2!

Some notes on classes.
Acceptable classes include: Barbarian, Bard, Druid, Fighter, Monk, Ranger, Rogue, Sorcerer, Wizard, Alchemist, Cavalier, Gunslinger, Magus, Oracle, Summoner (Called Demonbinder), Witch, Ninja, and Samurai. Also the Artificer class from the 3rd Party - Adamant Entertainment section is acceptable.

Summoners are called Demonbinders, regardless of how they practice their craft. Their Eidolons must have demonic cosmetic features, but is otherwise treated the same.

Druids, Oracles and Witches face some persecution for their divine abilities (Rangers are encouraged to take an archetype that removes or changes their spellcasting ability such as the Skirmisher or Trapper, else they will also face persecution). This persecution is mostly social in nature. You won't get arrested for casting a cure spell in public, but you'll likely have armed soldiers following you for a while afterward and you'll likely be refused entrance to most establishments.

Monks are prevented from openly practicing, and anyone seen showing proficiency in martial arts combat is suspected of being a monk and arrested.

Ninja and Samurai must keep their natures secret. The samurai orders were disbanded following the occupation and samurai were required to turn in their ancestral weapons and armor. Some chose exile instead, finding homes among the bandit groups, finding a resistance group, or simply living in the wilds on their own. Regardless, any samurai that is identified is taken into custody, their weapons and armor are confiscated and they are turned out onto the streets.
Ninja have it slightly easier, as they were already pretty secretive. The ninja clans were likewise disbanded during the occupation, but unlike the samurai, they mostly just moved into secret instead of actually disbanding. Discovered ninja are treated as rebels and either locked up or executed, depending on the situation.


And some other notes.

Arcanotech: A fancy name for magical items produced in the west. They typically look more techy than traditional fantasy magic items, but function the same.

Firearms: Only Early firearms exist. Their possession is restriction to westerners, though they can fall into easterner hands on occasion. The exception is the firelance, which can be found in anyone's hands. Additionally, all firearms have their misfire values increased by one.
Because there's a couple of conflicting pages on the SRD about firearms, this is the one that will be used:

Dragon Powder: A more stable form of black powder. If used in firearms, it reduces the misfire value by 2 (so one less than the value given in the rules), but imposes a -1 penalty to attack and damage rolls. A keg of dragon powder only explodes for 5d4 points of damage (with the same reflex save as a black powder keg). It costs the same as black powder.


Coming soon: Notable locations, notable people (Historic and Current), power groups and some kind of map.
 
OP
IronAnt

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Christ Maiko, how did you type that much up?

I have work soon, so I need to bugger off for now. I'll be around to work on more stuff later. I'll let everyone know when I edit that post.


Keylo, thank you for that. If there is room you should totally play with us.
 

maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

I've had this stuff in my head for a while... just needed an outlet. I also have about as much information thought up for a sci-fi space-opera setting, a post-apocalyptic, vehicular combat setting (just needs a good system for vehicular combat. Think Twisted Metal/Vigilante 8 style, or if you were lucky enough to have played it during its brief time, Auto Assault, from which it draws heavily from), and a sandboxy, mindcraft-esk style setting wherein the players are colonists on an alien planet. Maybe some day...

Edit: Post 1000! Wooo! *goes to party*
 
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Mamono Assault Force

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

In this bleak and corrupt world... Super Cat Man will take over and make the world AWESOME!

SCatMan for short.

I had to do a Scatman joke. I've been holding it in for a while.

I'm sorry.
 

Keylo

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Here's my sheet for IronAnt's game

Also, I'm aware than banning conjuration hurts, I've already taken a note that a lot of crowd control spells are conjuration. Flight is transmutation and illusion has some teleportation-like options, though they're more limited. For the other stuff I'll just have to work around it.
Well actually there's a easy and cheap way around that in an arcane discovery known as Opposition Research, but I didn't want to give too much build advice. But I digress.


I'm assuming the Con bonus to health is it's modifier times level. Ergo getting 14 up from 10 will net me an extra 4 health.

But this error really came from the COMPLETE lack of notice in the character creation section, which only talked about rolling the hit die for starting HP. I looked it over three times because I thought I was a tard, but it's not there.

The description for Con (on the site) mentions it's influence on HP, but doesn't tell me how much.
It's better to view it the level modifier as a base of "10" to be honest, because you gain your hit die + con mod per level in HP. ((So 14 CON vs 10 Con is more generally a difference of 20 hp, and if a game somehow goes to 20, it's a difference of 40 HP, which hurts.)) Trust me when I say every drop of HP matters, especially at lower levels though.

But yeah, that's stuff that isn't really clear in character generation, and generally why it's good to have someone walk you through it the first time.

Christ Maiko, how did you type that much up?

I have work soon, so I need to bugger off for now. I'll be around to work on more stuff later. I'll let everyone know when I edit that post.


Keylo, thank you for that. If there is room you should totally play with us.
If there's room sure, but don't worry about it. I'm mostly just trying to get back into the swing of things.
 

maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Well actually there's a easy and cheap way around that in an arcane discovery known as Opposition Research, but I didn't want to give too much build advice. But I digress.
Incidentally, there's also Shadow Conjuration and its derivatives. If you're smart with your shadow spells, in many cases your foes won't even get that disbelieve roll making them almost as effective as the spells they're copying. Also, with Conjuration spells like teleport, that are cast on friendlies, the shadow spells are just as good as conjuration, since, even if your allies do have to make a save, they can just choose to automatically fail (Willful suspension of disbelief!)

Also, if you really want to go with shadow magic, check out the shadowcaster archetype. At 10th level, your shadow spells are 20% stronger if the target disbelieves. Greater Shadow Evocation then moves up to being 80% effective if they disbelive it, and Shades moves up to 100% effective, making the result of the disbelief roll moot. (Those are rather high level spells though, Shades being 9th level, but still...)

I had an alternate build for Syl where she was an illusionist and used a good amount of shadow spells interspersed with full on illusions and the full power versions of the spells to toy with enemies. Illusions are fun.

As a small aside on the shadow spells, while they can only copy spells that are at least one level lower than them (so Shadow Evocation, a 5th level spell, can only copy Evocation spells of 4th level or lower), the save DCs and all other effects related to the level of the spell being cast, such as if it gets through a Globe of Invulnerability, are the level of the Shadow spell. So if you use Shadow Evocation to cast a Fireball, the save DC for it would be as a 5th level spell, instead of a 3rd. They're also still illusion spells so Spell Focus (Illusion) would boost them even further, and Spell Focus is a feat that is nearly essential for Illusionists.

Yah... Illusions are my favorite school of magic...
 

Hentaispider

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Incidentally, there's also Shadow Conjuration and its derivatives. If you're smart with your shadow spells, in many cases your foes won't even get that disbelieve roll making them almost as effective as the spells they're copying. Also, with Conjuration spells like teleport, that are cast on friendlies, the shadow spells are just as good as conjuration, since, even if your allies do have to make a save, they can just choose to automatically fail (Willful suspension of disbelief!)

Also, if you really want to go with shadow magic, check out the shadowcaster archetype. At 10th level, your shadow spells are 20% stronger if the target disbelieves. Greater Shadow Evocation then moves up to being 80% effective if they disbelive it, and Shades moves up to 100% effective, making the result of the disbelief roll moot. (Those are rather high level spells though, Shades being 9th level, but still...)

I had an alternate build for Syl where she was an illusionist and used a good amount of shadow spells interspersed with full on illusions and the full power versions of the spells to toy with enemies. Illusions are fun.

As a small aside on the shadow spells, while they can only copy spells that are at least one level lower than them (so Shadow Evocation, a 5th level spell, can only copy Evocation spells of 4th level or lower), the save DCs and all other effects related to the level of the spell being cast, such as if it gets through a Globe of Invulnerability, are the level of the Shadow spell. So if you use Shadow Evocation to cast a Fireball, the save DC for it would be as a 5th level spell, instead of a 3rd. They're also still illusion spells so Spell Focus (Illusion) would boost them even further, and Spell Focus is a feat that is nearly essential for Illusionists.

Yah... Illusions are my favorite school of magic...
I actually have the shadowcaster archetype, took it because it's pretty thematic and because I didn't really want to get a familiar or bonded object. Though Shadow conjuration can't replicate teleportation spells, summoning and creation subschools only.
 

maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

I actually have the shadowcaster archetype, took it because it's pretty thematic and because I didn't really want to get a familiar or bonded object. Though Shadow conjuration can't replicate teleportation spells, summoning and creation subschools only.
Ah... That's what I get for not reading the full description. Oh well. There's always Shadow Walk. That's more interesting anyway.
 

Keylo

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Incidentally, there's also Shadow Conjuration and its derivatives. If you're smart with your shadow spells, in many cases your foes won't even get that disbelieve roll making them almost as effective as the spells they're copying. Also, with Conjuration spells like teleport, that are cast on friendlies, the shadow spells are just as good as conjuration, since, even if your allies do have to make a save, they can just choose to automatically fail (Willful suspension of disbelief!)

Also, if you really want to go with shadow magic, check out the shadowcaster archetype. At 10th level, your shadow spells are 20% stronger if the target disbelieves. Greater Shadow Evocation then moves up to being 80% effective if they disbelive it, and Shades moves up to 100% effective, making the result of the disbelief roll moot. (Those are rather high level spells though, Shades being 9th level, but still...)

I had an alternate build for Syl where she was an illusionist and used a good amount of shadow spells interspersed with full on illusions and the full power versions of the spells to toy with enemies. Illusions are fun.

As a small aside on the shadow spells, while they can only copy spells that are at least one level lower than them (so Shadow Evocation, a 5th level spell, can only copy Evocation spells of 4th level or lower), the save DCs and all other effects related to the level of the spell being cast, such as if it gets through a Globe of Invulnerability, are the level of the Shadow spell. So if you use Shadow Evocation to cast a Fireball, the save DC for it would be as a 5th level spell, instead of a 3rd. They're also still illusion spells so Spell Focus (Illusion) would boost them even further, and Spell Focus is a feat that is nearly essential for Illusionists.

Yah... Illusions are my favorite school of magic...
Believe me when I state that one of my players (up till the point I stopped running anyway) of late has more than thoroughly drilled that into my head. Though the main issue with illusion magic and effective use of it with regard to disbelieve rolls and the likes is that all of it revolves are DM Fiat and judgment. With a more loose and creative DM, illusion is arguably one of the strongest schools of magic in the game. With a more stringent one though...far less so. ((Though Illusion still provides some of the best defensive spells in the game, in the form of blur, displacement, invisibility, mirror image, and so forth)). Due to certain experiences, I prefer spells that the DM can't handwave (even if I know the DM isn't that type of DM) if it's not to their favor. Well that and illusionists are favored by gnomes. And I hate gnomes. ((With that said, some of the shadow spells were nerfed in PF :X)).
 

GargantuaBlarg

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Illusion magic is the fuckin' shit.


Like, thematically. I leov illusions. Mechanically, fuck if I know anything about them. <_>
 

Hentaispider

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

The big thing about illusions is that you don't get a save to disbelieve unless you interact with the illusion in some way. The big problem about this is that what counts as interaction isn't really defined officially, so it's up to the GM to determine, though I think there's a semi-official ruling somewhere that it should generally take an action to interact with the illusion before you get a save.
 

maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

The big thing about illusions is that you don't get a save to disbelieve unless you interact with the illusion in some way. The big problem about this is that what counts as interaction isn't really defined officially, so it's up to the GM to determine, though I think there's a semi-official ruling somewhere that it should generally take an action to interact with the illusion before you get a save.
Well, the main thing is that you need to have a reason to believe that what you're seeing is an illusion in order to get the save. For things like silent image, trying to touch it and seeing your hand pass through it is definitely cause for believing it's fake (and in an instance like that, I think you automatically disbelieve it). Something like a shadow spell is a bit harder. As I understand it, you have to have a reason to believe the fireball coming towards you is an illusion in order to get that first will save. This can be because you identified that the person wasn't casting fireball, because they've shown to use illusions before, or something else, and really would depend on the individual. And then there's the simple matter of the save itself. Fail that and the spell is treated as being full power, even if you had suspected it of being an illusion anyway.

A smart illusionist would throw real fireballs (or other spells) in with the shadow ones to make the enemy believe that all of their spells were real ones.

And, again, almost all illusions have a save associated with them, so it's smart for an illusionist to invest in as many ways to raise the save DCs on their spells as possible, thus, even if an enemy does suspect that fireball may not be all there, they'll still have a hard time disbelieving it (and those boosts to DC also apply to whatever saves the copied spell might require as well, like a fireball's reflex save).

And there's other, clever ways to use Shadow spells. Use a Shadow Conjuration to summon a giant to start a rockslide. Set something on fire with a Shadow Evocation Flaming Sphere. The secondary effects aren't illusions, and thus, can't be disbelieved. Then there's utility uses that let you get away with not knowing other spells. Shadow Conjure a bridge to cross a gap, for instance.

But this isn't really a place to talk about strategies in using illusions... I got a little carried away.
 

Shrike7

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Alrighty, nearly done my stuff. Maiko and Ant, send me a PM or get somebody int he shout to hit me on AIM when you guys are around and available for settings chat, i have many questions that are less than relevant for the group as a hole. in the meanwhile, got the sheet for Maiko's more or less done, at least.



(side note to our mechanics-checker: I'm aware of her glaring weaknesses they are on purpose ;) )
 

Keylo

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Alrighty, nearly done my stuff. Maiko and Ant, send me a PM or get somebody int he shout to hit me on AIM when you guys are around and available for settings chat, i have many questions that are less than relevant for the group as a hole. in the meanwhile, got the sheet for Maiko's more or less done, at least.



(side note to our mechanics-checker: I'm aware of her glaring weaknesses they are on purpose ;) )
Hey, it's your choice. But you STILL forgot your favored class points. That's the most glaring error I see anyway. Also, note that until you take weapon finesse, you're completely infunctional in melee, but that might be intentional so~...
 

Shrike7

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

my favoured class points are going towards bonus rogue talents, one every six levels. and yes, i'm well aware, finesse is going to be the next talent i take.
 

Mamono Assault Force

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

I'm free almost every day except wednesdays and thursdays.

Also. Maikochan. Mounts. Can we has.
 

maikochan

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Mounts, yes. I'd suggest getting one only if you want to make it a bigger part of your character than just a means of transportation. For the most part, your patron, whoever that is, will provide mounts if necessary. Unless, of course, you decide to go it alone. That'll be something that'll need to be discussed before the game starts.
 

Tiffanian

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

Character is more or less done. The spells list thing is just what I feel I would typically prepare from the spell list in the notes on an average day, I would really like some advice on that though. There is at least one I'm not sure about.

 

Mamono Assault Force

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Re: Pathfinder, anyone?

So, are we going to use basic chat, or are you guys going with Roll20. I'll see about maybe learning how to use that program as a player so we don't have to spend our gametime doing a class session (Since I'm likely one of the few/only people who doesn't know howtoRoll20)
 
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